| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] > | Too many secrets (What if there are too many translation agencies?) Thread poster: Mario Chavez (X)
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Samuel Murray 
Netherlands
Local time: 11:49
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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| Different people excel at different things | Dec 20, 2017 |
Mario Chavez wrote:
It seems that some translators do one of the following after receiving their BA diplomas as sworn translators:
1. Get an in-house translation job (a very small minority);
2. Teach languages;
3. Set up an agency with a former classmate;
4. Go out to work as a project manager for a local agency;
5. Start slowly translating for a number of clients.
This array of options simply confirms that not all translators have the same skills and interests. Some are interested in translation as a subject but does not want to or is able to become a translator.
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Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market.
Are they clients, though, or sharks?
In the movie business, an agent's client is the actor, not the studio. They represent the seller and use their contacts to get suitable work from a buyer.
In the translation business, it's generally the other way around. The agencies just drum up work from buyers and then farm it out to the (cheapest) seller. They're money-grabbing middlemen somewhere down there with back-street car dealers.
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Mario Chavez wrote:
Let's say you agree with me that there are too many agencies. What things can we do about it?
1) Yes, I agree with you.
2) Nothing.
| | | | | not quite... | Dec 20, 2017 |
Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market.
there are clients and clients...
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Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 05:49
Spanish to English
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| Exactly right | Dec 20, 2017 |
Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote: Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market. there are clients and clients...
I do not consider as potential clients agencies willing to pay me no more than half of what I typically charge, and that submit payment one month later than I typically deem acceptable.
| | | | Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 05:49
Spanish to English
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| Food for thought | Dec 20, 2017 |
Chris S wrote: Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market. Are they clients, though, or sharks? In the movie business, an agent's client is the actor, not the studio. They represent the seller and use their contacts to get suitable work from a buyer. In the translation business, it's generally the other way around. The agencies just drum up work from buyers and then farm it out to the (cheapest) seller. They're money-grabbing middlemen somewhere down there with back-street car dealers.
The concluding observation here is worthy of sober reflection.
[Edited at 2017-12-20 15:35 GMT]
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 11:49
French to English
There probably are too many translators, or we'd be able to maintain decent prices more easily.
I don't know about too many agencies. Certainly there are too many operating on a letterbox basis, and not enough who genuinely want to deliver a top-rate translation to their clients. The best ones I find are the smaller ones, so I'd posit that there are too many big agencies: it's the biggest ones who bully us the most.
Another kind of firm there are clearly too many of:... See more There probably are too many translators, or we'd be able to maintain decent prices more easily.
I don't know about too many agencies. Certainly there are too many operating on a letterbox basis, and not enough who genuinely want to deliver a top-rate translation to their clients. The best ones I find are the smaller ones, so I'd posit that there are too many big agencies: it's the biggest ones who bully us the most.
Another kind of firm there are clearly too many of: CAT software firms. Hardly any are making much money, and they're being propped up by big agencies who want to be able to boast of having their "proprietary software" (yet are incapable of using it properly themselves).
[Edited at 2017-12-20 15:36 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 11:49
French to English
Samuel Murray wrote: Mario Chavez wrote:
It seems that some translators do one of the following after receiving their BA diplomas as sworn translators:
1. Get an in-house translation job (a very small minority);
2. Teach languages;
3. Set up an agency with a former classmate;
4. Go out to work as a project manager for a local agency;
5. Start slowly translating for a number of clients.
This array of options simply confirms that not all translators have the same skills and interests. Some are interested in translation as a subject but does not want to or is able to become a translator.
Someone wanting to become a good translator would do well to start out doing in-house translation, it's a great way to learn the trade. Not always possible though, positions are few and far between (far more offers for interns than for fully-fledged employees last time I looked).
I see nothing wrong with doing any of the other options. Everyone does what they can with what they've got and we don't always get many opportunities for what we really want to do. Some don't want to free-lance and would prefer to teach for a salary if they can't translate for a salary, and it's perfectly legit.
The top-rate agency I used to work for was set up by a couple of newly-qualified translators. They implemented a process that was fully geared to producing the best possible translations, with systematic proofreading, only using CAT tools when there was a clear benefit in terms of quality, and people only working into their native languages. Exactly the kind of agency I love to work for.
[Edited at 2017-12-20 15:40 GMT]
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Mario Chavez (X)
Local time: 05:49
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER | Not the movie business! | Dec 20, 2017 |
Chris S wrote: Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market. Are they clients, though, or sharks? In the movie business, an agent's client is the actor, not the studio. They represent the seller and use their contacts to get suitable work from a buyer. In the translation business, it's generally the other way around. The agencies just drum up work from buyers and then farm it out to the (cheapest) seller. They're money-grabbing middlemen somewhere down there with back-street car dealers.
Given the dismal 2017 year for the movie business with scandals, there are sharks and chumbucket exploiters as well. Or maybe they should be called octopi?
| | | | Mario Chavez (X)
Local time: 05:49
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER | Maybe translation agencies should be more regulated then | Dec 20, 2017 |
Tomás Cano Binder, BA, CT wrote:
What I have seen often is translators that fail to manage their business correctly and keep working for bad payers and unreliable small agencies. At one point in time, they begin to feel cheated and decide that they will now become agencies and make some money out of squeezing other translators, without improving their management and negotiation skills. As a result, some markets have an outrageous number of agencies that pay atrocious rates and drive more translators to become more awful agencies.
At some point in time, translators have to learn to stop working for bad payers and unreliable little agencies in favour of professional agencies that have better management and negotiation skills and are capable of achieving better rates from customers and better pay for translators. We would be far better off with more healthy, professional agencies, and more quality-conscious translators that feel pride in what they do.
Some translators should never become agencies as their core skills lie elsewhere, not in heading and sustaining a viable business. I know my strengths and weaknesses: marketing services, for instance, is not something I excel at, or bothering to rent a downtown office, hire office staff to make phone calls, etc. So I never cared for my practice to take on the shape of an agency.
In the nuanced discussion of regulating the profession, I should say I'm also in favor of regulating the agencies. Want to be a translation agency? There are tests, there's a registry, you have to submit a business plan, tax records, P&L statements, bank statements, a couple of recommendations from other businesses, etc. And you have to be recertified every year to keep your translation agency business license in our city, municipality, province or state, etc. Oh! And let's see if the regulatory body (something like a Department of Consumer Protection) has logged complaints against you in the last 2-5 years before we give you a license.
Let's see what happens then.
| | | | Mario Chavez (X)
Local time: 05:49
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER
Samuel Murray wrote: Mario Chavez wrote:
It seems that some translators do one of the following after receiving their BA diplomas as sworn translators:
1. Get an in-house translation job (a very small minority);
2. Teach languages;
3. Set up an agency with a former classmate;
4. Go out to work as a project manager for a local agency;
5. Start slowly translating for a number of clients.
This array of options simply confirms that not all translators have the same skills and interests. Some are interested in translation as a subject but does not want to or is able to become a translator.
I think all employment opportunities in the world of language practice (including translation, project management, etc.) should be discussed at translator training level (or with a college career counselor who is well informed) and encouraged throughout the course. Some translation students end up being excellent project managers.
| | | | | What we can do as translators | Dec 20, 2017 |
Never as in this year have I been flooded with requests from new clients, especially in the last few months and mind, I am not marketing myself whatsoever. What I do as a translator is what I have always been doing since I started, 24 years ago: Refusing to work at insulting rates, and stating that clearly to agencies which come up with "their budget". Simple as that, and I have never regretted it.
Otherwise, there is not much else we can do. We don't really exactly know what is go... See more Never as in this year have I been flooded with requests from new clients, especially in the last few months and mind, I am not marketing myself whatsoever. What I do as a translator is what I have always been doing since I started, 24 years ago: Refusing to work at insulting rates, and stating that clearly to agencies which come up with "their budget". Simple as that, and I have never regretted it.
Otherwise, there is not much else we can do. We don't really exactly know what is going on in our industry, we can only guess.
Good Luck Everyone!
Giusi ▲ Collapse
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Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:49
Serbian to English
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| Agencies are not clients | Dec 21, 2017 |
Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market.
You are confusing the legal/formal aspect with real economics - i.e. real "offer and demand"
Agencies have as much use for translated texts as a cargo carrier would need whatever it is transporting.
The real "clients" are businesses and individuals that need language services - agencies are just that - someone else's agents - middleman of very varying usefulness.
So - no, I don't find anything strange in service providers complaining that there are too many self-serving middlemen [all too often doing a disservice to both sides they are supposed to be bringing together].
| | | | Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 05:49
Spanish to English
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Daryo wrote:
So - no, I don't find anything strange in service providers complaining that there are too many self-serving middlemen [all too often doing a disservice to both sides they are supposed to be bringing together].
This is exactly right. Such parties frequently charge a high markup to their end clients for what is often nothing more than acting as brokers, and whatever value they might claim to add (mainly proofing and formatting) could be handled by qualified professionals a good deal more economically without the involvement of middlemen.
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 11:49
French to English
| even the worst | Dec 22, 2017 |
Daryo wrote: Daniel Frisano wrote:
I swear this is the first time in my life that I see a group of providers wondering if there are too many clients in the market. You are confusing the legal/formal aspect with real economics - i.e. real "offer and demand" Agencies have as much use for translated texts as a cargo carrier would need whatever it is transporting. The real "clients" are businesses and individuals that need language services - agencies are just that - someone else's agents - middleman of very varying usefulness. So - no, I don't find anything strange in service providers complaining that there are too many self-serving middlemen [all too often doing a disservice to both sides they are supposed to be bringing together].
If the middleman doesn't provide an acceptable service, they won't last.
Remember though, that even the worst of agencies will relieve their clients of the hassle of looking for several different translators. If the client only has occasional, small texts to be translated, and only into one or two languages, they don't need an agency. But those who have their files translated into several languages, or who have so much to be translated that the project needs to be split among several translators, will find it easier to offload the whole thing to an agency than start contacting several different translators.
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